Pushing FPS Limits

Airsoft safety discussion. Post here with questions about laws and safety concerns.

Postby McNair » Sun Feb 05, 2012 10:56 pm

That's fine. If you don't like shit, you can not let it be posted. Just like you don't have to go.

In the end, this has been the unwritten rule for 10 years and no one has complained.
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Postby Bircher » Sun Feb 05, 2012 11:03 pm

Higher FPS= higher risk
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Postby Steve » Sun Feb 05, 2012 11:39 pm

I still don't really see the issue with higher FPS. Anything over 270 FPS can still knock out a tooth (and it's probably lower than 270). I've played CQB at 450+ FPS, full auto, no minimum engagement range. It hurts, but it doesn't kill you.

As to why higher FPS is "better", I submit that the higher FPS pellets reach their target faster. Which means that folks that are moving into and out of cover have less time from when you pull the trigger to when the round hits.

Whatever the event promoter thinks people will pay to play it is what the event should be set at. Assuming that their insurance company will accept the FPS limits, it all comes down to what FPS the folks that show up want to play at. And the only vote that actually matters is the one in your wallet.

Oh, and as to risk: *cough* Phillipines *cough*
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Postby Russkie » Sun Feb 05, 2012 11:52 pm

Time for me to stir up the bowl. I know I'm going to get shit for this.

In terms of CQB, here is some food for thought. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3LvcwoXJZlI

I've played no limit FPS games before. No problems. In all honesty I can't feel the difference in FPS. All I know is I'm getting shot and it's not pleasant. If you want to argue safety, go play at below whatever the FPS is that won't damage skin (probably like 150 FPS).

450 FPS is not putting that much stress on your gearbox. Not even 500. Ask any airsoft tech who knows what they are going. 500 FPS at 32 RPS (1920 RPM) or even more while running reliably is completely possible.

Also, More FPS=More Range. Take a physics class and learn Newtonian Mechanics. There are a lot more variables to what gives you more range such as the bore of the barrel, your hop-up, etc., but if you take two guns with an identical setup but with difference FPS, the one with more FPS will get more range.

I like the DMR rule. It should be restricted to real world DMR like the SVD or SL8 though. This would be similar to the SAW restriction.

I think SAWs should have higher FPS limit. It would be more realistic and actually give them an advantage much like in real life. Caring a high cap in a gun that weighs twice to three times as much as a standard rifle doesn't seem like much of an advantage. I'd still take a rifle and midcaps over that.



Before you guys go off and try to accuse me being some newb lord who runs a 500 FPS gun, I'd like to say that the only airsoft gun I have is my AKM and it runs at 360 FPS. I never play indoor and even if my gun was legal indoors, I wouldn't bother since I'm just not a huge fan of speedball arena gameplay.
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Postby McNair » Sun Feb 05, 2012 11:57 pm

Russkie is just Russian and therefore not afraid of anything.
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Postby Evil Zergling137 » Mon Feb 06, 2012 12:41 am

Someone got let on the field at 440fps full auto? wtf! Event organizers can't do that. You can't tell people there are limits to what will be thrown at them and then ignore them. That is the type of thing that goes past a waver and makes them liable for punitive damages.

The bolt limit being 550fps instead of 600fps brings ash bash in line with normal rules. DMR should probably be 475 anyway as a hard limit.
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Postby G36 FTW » Mon Feb 06, 2012 1:10 am

Arguing about FPS again?

I don't understand it at all. None of my AEGs run over 350 fps, and I have yet to find anyone who can out-range my G36C by more than a few yards.

And with the physics references to distance gained by faster speed, the same argument could be used in force transferred to a target. The faster a bb travels, the more damage it can cause. Raising the fps limit from 400 to 420 won't do any good for players performance, and it raises the energy a bb would deliver 10% (.15 J)

Warning: Math

Physics with a .2g bb at 400fps:
KE=1/2mv^2
KE=1.49N (Also 1.49 J)

Physics with a .2g bb at 420fps:
KE=1/2mv^2
KE=1.64N (Also 1.64J)

Remember that the velocity of something raises the energy it produces at a ratio of 4 to 1, which is why 300fps only produces approximately 1J but 400fps delivers almost 1.5J.
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Postby McNair » Mon Feb 06, 2012 1:20 am

No one is proposing a raise to 420. It's always been a cut off at 420. Some people are apparenlty just now realizing it and crying wolf.
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Postby Jewish Ninja » Mon Feb 06, 2012 7:25 am

Too many people see a limit as a goal which is kinda silly.

I've been playing cqc using 350FPS blasters along with everyone else there and it hasn't been an issue. A 20 FPS difference hasn't really been more dangerous in my eyes.
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Postby pulsipher » Mon Feb 06, 2012 8:02 am

330 FPS FOR ALL


Seriously I dont even know what FPS my replicas are shooting. I appreciate the fact that i can go from 330 to 450 with a touch of a knob on my SAW but why would i need to?

I guess my vote doesnt count for much either since its not likely that Ill make it to a game in AP anytime soon
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Postby pathfinder » Mon Feb 06, 2012 8:23 am

who runs this fuckin show....you do matt. so remove the post.

there needs to be some control over this hobby of yours or YOU WILL LOOSE IT.


think i am wrong? think again.
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Fps limits

Postby crazydemon » Mon Feb 06, 2012 8:24 am

I play for the 104th S.A.R.S. team out of coos bay. We play every two weeks and have between 20 and 30 people at every game. And we enforce the fps limits set up by AP. And have no problems doing so.

Matt you run one of the largest Airsoft communities here in the US. If your worried that they are raising limits to increase sales and let safety be damn then maybe you as the Head Chief should contact and let them know your concerns.

The rules set forth by AP are easy to follow and no one that we play with has ever had any issues following them. If someone gets a new gun that shoots a hot we don't allow it on the field until its been mod'd to meet the rules or has had enough rounds shot through it to break it in a bit.

Again the best way to enforce the AP rules. Is to form a league. Get all your local team captains together. Discuss what rules your gonna have and how you are going to enforce there play.

If you don't have everyone on the same page then this is just going to turn into another debate that never comes up with an answer. You will always have people trying to up there limits, some do it for better performance and most seem to do it to be malicious the second kind are not the people you want to see on your field anyway.

We in southern Oregon coast are a small airsoft community I know, and I don't really like turning away people. But you have to stand up and enforce your rules otherwise what is the point of rules.

Just my 2 cents.
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Postby Matt » Mon Feb 06, 2012 9:03 am

I'd rather see the community and the promoters on the same page. It's got to be frustrating to be new in this community when you read one limit on AP.com Safety Rules and another limit on a game, then a different limit on the next game. There's games you can use DMR and games you can't. I think if it's working, consider those game promoters "the pilot" test and let's make it official. If limits are HARD, then everyone should enforce them that way, not 1 FPS over allowed. Let's not have 1 group enforcing the soft limit and another group enforcing the hard limit, that will only confuse and annoy.
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Re: Fps limits

Postby Osprey » Mon Feb 06, 2012 9:12 am

crazydemon wrote:I play for the 104th S.A.R.S. team out of coos bay. We play every two weeks and have between 20 and 30 people at every game. And we enforce the fps limits set up by AP. And have no problems doing so.

Matt you run one of the largest Airsoft communities here in the US. If your worried that they are raising limits to increase sales and let safety be damn then maybe you as the Head Chief should contact and let them know your concerns.

The rules set forth by AP are easy to follow and no one that we play with has ever had any issues following them. If someone gets a new gun that shoots a hot we don't allow it on the field until its been mod'd to meet the rules or has had enough rounds shot through it to break it in a bit.

Again the best way to enforce the AP rules. Is to form a league. Get all your local team captains together. Discuss what rules your gonna have and how you are going to enforce there play.

If you don't have everyone on the same page then this is just going to turn into another debate that never comes up with an answer. You will always have people trying to up there limits, some do it for better performance and most seem to do it to be malicious the second kind are not the people you want to see on your field anyway.

We in southern Oregon coast are a small airsoft community I know, and I don't really like turning away people. But you have to stand up and enforce your rules otherwise what is the point of rules.

Just my 2 cents.
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Postby crazydemon » Mon Feb 06, 2012 9:14 am

Well I think that is pretty easy Matt, if you want to promote a game on AP make sure your game follows all the AP rules and guidelines.
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