Jeep's guide on Support gun replicas and mini multi review:

Jeep's guide on Support gun replicas and mini multi review:

Postby Jeep » Tue Mar 17, 2009 7:23 am

This was one of my responses to another forums post on airsoft machine guns, I put some time into it and it turned out pretty informative so I am cross posting it here. In my opinion, for what its worth with either personal experience on the field with the replicas or I own them my self unless noted. I have done a whole lot of searching question asking a borrowing on the field before I bought my replicas. I realize that you only asked about M249s but here is a over view of what is available. It is my hope that this will answer any questions you have and anyone else that used the search function as well in the future.

TSD/SCR RPK, great if it fits your load out, the only issues I have had involve poor gearbox grease from the factory and the fact I have replaced the lower receiver four times as the stock keeps busting off if you look at it wrong. I have in excess of 50000 Bbs through it in the last couple of years. It has been been factory rebuilt once in that period of time. There is a review of this replica on this forum. Real sword, Classic army and Inokatsu all make RPKs as well, I have no experience with them.
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STAR M60E4/ Mk43, (ARES) Fantastic replica, much better than the abortion they call a M249, Nearly all made of Aluminum with some ballistic nylon parts externally. It has a poly carbonate gearbox similar but NOT identical to the M249. this mech box has a two position spring guide, position one is longer and more relaxed, this reduces gearbox strain, increased ROF at the cost of some velocity. Postion two chokes the spring up to roughly the length of a "normal AEG" this increases velocity and slows the ROF down a little. It is suggested to run this AEG on a 9.6 battery. However it is blessed with the WORST sucktastic box magazine ever to grace a machine gun replica. It is BAD on a new level of BAD, making the replica all but unusable in stock form. The magazine feeds so intermittently that it will dry fire a lot. Quick fix is to run it on a 8.4 volt battery and run the spring choked up in position two. A more involved fix is a sector chip and gutting the boxmag and replacing internals. Good news they are a bargain right now for as low as $350, look at the STARthread on this forum to get a jest of what you are getting into. Just expect to spend some money on magazine repairs/ upgrades. This is a great budget support replica. My review is on going at c3airsoft

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Ares is making the same replica but have improved it with a metal mech box, a new box magazine, they are also making these available as replacement parts for those of us with the STAR version in the near future. Either buy the ARES build or plan on rebuilding the STAR's powered magazine. ARES Representative has made it clear to me that ARES is the manufacture not a re brander of STAR replicas. They are well aware of the deficiencies on the replicas labeled by STAR and are taking steps to correct their products made from the same pattern, different but the same.

A&K/ECHO1 M249 Fantastic budget support (clone) replica patterned after the CA replica, may need some immediate upgrades to last the abuse a support gunner will put it through. Some feeding issues in the feed tube and trigger switch contact problems. Easy change out springs to quickly change velocity is a nice feature. These are the SAME replica, ECHO 1 just adds a extra layer of quality assurance to the product, A&K adds a gun spiffy gun case to hold your broken replica. Honestly, any support gun is going to need repair sooner or latter, most of them will need some upgrades right away, This Replica goes for as low as $250 giving you $220-$500 worth of upgrades before you start competing with more expensive replicas like CA and TOP and nearly $1000 before Inokatsu, VFC and Shoei start to compete price wise. Even if you get a lemon you are still way ahead money wise so they really are a bargain. So much so that I broke down and bought one for $180 at E hobbies Asia. I will amend my experiences in the future. In the mean time here is a fantastic review by Far East over at Arnies

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X Ranger stock (I have a image I just got to find it)

Classic ARMY, M249s, With out question, these are THE platform which most players build support guns, Much better than top or Star, more affordable than Inokatsu and Escort. My only concern is CA once again lost their quality control in the move to main land China. Still a bit pricey when compared to the clone M249. Box magazine that feeds reliable is a big plus.
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Image M4 stocked M249 image goes here

STAR M249, Described as so bad at Arnie's, that anyone handling one should wash their hands in turpentine! I have only seen three of these, they were all broken, I don't have any trigger time because they were all broken. Wild monkey makes a metal mech box replacement but the largely plastic gun body tends to fail spectacularly.
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It says something that ARES is not producing their own version of this replica M249 (FN MINIMI), because it has to many problems with it. They are however making a Mk48, Which is a Navy SEAL version that is chambered for 7.62x39 and a MK46 (Navy M249) and buried under a RIS I am not sure it is related to the older STAR M249 though as It is new and I have NO experience with the ARES MK46/mk48other than it exists. Look real careful at the front of the body you will see the difference between the M249/FN Minimi and the mk46/48 Also shown in the images is ARES replacement MK43/M60E4 components
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STAR L86, like most STAR replicas, the guy I know had to put a lot of time and money into it. It still problematic. Reoccurring air nozzle problems causing a leak near the hop up chamber. Once again this replica is also available form ARES, which has tweaked it internally.

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TOP M60, M249s EVERYBODY I have shared the field with that has one of these has ditched the bellows system for aftermarket AEG V3 mech boxes. Figure this into the cost of owning one as it is all but necessary for reliable operation. The bellows system is a strange concept that should have stayed a concept. Once the bellows tears (common) you are basically screwed. Bicycle inner tube rubber makes a good hop up bucking replacement. Nice externals and the only alternative to Inokatsu and Escort if you need a VN era M60. Airsoft Pacific has this TOP buyers guide that is pretty informative. Great externals, and most of the internal issues have been worked out with upgrade parts. Again this is a good budget support replica but there are cheaper alternatives.
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Inokatsu, VFC, Shoei, ESCORT, and other very high end replica manufactures. lots of off the wall rare support guns here, M60s, M240 (FN MAG) , RPK, M249, MG34, MG42 but who can afford them? Not me. No experience using one of these.
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Airsharp, Killbucket has made a lot of off the wall replicas, including a how too on how to make a hk21 out of G3, Airsharp markets plans, kits and ready to go support guns of the M1917, M1919 and M2 HMGs. Early replicas were AGM and CYMA M14s torn down and upgraded at the heart of the custom builds, latter builds are upgraded M249 mechanism (new not gun tear downs) He also has at least three types on miniguns.

There are several enthusiast that have built support gun replicas that are not available normally, if you search you can find M2 HMG (powder by compress gas) MG34, MG42s, Stoner 63's, and even PKMs or on the easier end of the spectrum, lots of MG36s (G36 modifications and Styer AUG LSW (a long replacement barrel on a AUG with bipod) have been done. Just beware that some larger airsoft events restrict machine gun type to more commonly used to differentiate the difference in replicas. the fact is HK21s, Mg36, L86, AUG LSW , and the M16 Shrike are just assault rifles with heavy barrels and a C MAG. In effect these are either low production or one off replicas that are complete custom builds.
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A word on mini guns: echo and other manufactures, expensive, complex and WHY! Unless you are building a fortification, tank, APC or helicopter gunship these don't do anything but break in really cool ways. Overtly, complex, heavy and very very expensive. So expensive you could own any 4 other replicas mentioned above minimum for the cost of one mini gun.


Based on my experience, ANY of the above replicas can be made into good reliable high rate of fire BB throwers, ALL of them will need attention of some sort to stand the pounding of sustained fire. If you don't do some careful upgrading to be able to fire sustained bursts of at least 14 secs then you only have a big, heavy, awkward AEG just like any other AEG with a Cmag on it. Pay particular attention to magazine feed issues, big batteries and use of MOFSET switches, The mech boxes may not necessarily need high speed gears (may cause feed problems if the box magazine can't keep up) But your shimming needs to be spot on, maintenance is a must even more so than a normal AEG. Also look for metal (reinforced gear box cases and metal bushings or large metal 8mm bearings. bearing spring guides and padded piston heads are often suggested, Anything that can reduce stresses and increase the easy in which the mechbox cycles are good things. Crazy ROF and high accuracy while nice. If is far more important for a support replica to feed consistently and for long periods of time (15 secs or so per burst). The goal here is to patter BBs off the oppositions cover and keep their heads down while your own team moves or to but a hail storm down of BB fire into a beaten zone between the enemies cover so they DON"T move around. In the end unless you do a lot of extra upgrades a AEG will perform the same regardless of what funny looking shape it is in. As far as upgrades go you need to decide that load out and role you wish to portray and how you want to AEG to perform in that role keeping in mind and field rules and any laws you must obey if your happen to live in one of the many Peoples Democratic Republic Workers Paradises of Unspecifiedistan. (PDRWPofU)
Last edited by Jeep on Fri Mar 04, 2011 11:25 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby Matt » Tue Mar 17, 2009 8:29 am

Thanks for the informative post, and for referencing my TOP M60 buyer's guide. :)
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Postby Beran » Tue Mar 17, 2009 8:40 am

my STAR Mk43 also had lots of problems with the hopup. the stock bucking was so thin and soft that the lip kept getting grabbed by the bb as it passed through and folded back in on itself, trapping the bb and jamming the gun. ive since replaced it with a mad bull bucking, but i haven't had a chance to test it yet. ive also been looking into picking up the ares magazine, because even after you fix it, the stock box isn't the best. where can you get them?
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Postby Jeep » Tue Mar 17, 2009 8:49 am

You just opened a huge can of worms:

A while ago it was pointed out in this thread that STAR replicas are selling for crazy reduced prices partially due to ARES which was a sub contractor for STAR making replicas under their own brand. This has not gone un-protested by STAR however. I worked a couple of hazmat spill and made enough money to take advantage of the situation and order one form E Hobby Asia. Since then, I have been burning up some PM folders and searching this forums and others for information. I am not liking what I am reading. Since I have no field time with this replica I really can not do a proper review. What I am going to propose to do is compile my experiences and as much information as I can gather into this thread. However, with STAR replicas selling at rock bottom prices and ARES making the same replicas and promising upgrades components I do not think I am alone in taking the risk in purchasing a STAR replica making this thread pertinent.

My research is pointing out that this is one heck of a project gun I am expecting a lot of trouble with the box magazine and mech box internal issues. These are common with STAR made replicas apparently and would be exasperated by being a support gun replica. I ask any one that has a STAR replica shoot me a PM especially if you solved the air seal issues. I have been warned to expect mech box shimming to be abysmal and to check this and make sure things are clean and greased. I have never been into a mech box proper so again I am expecting to need some guidance here as well. I would also like to publicly thank Noobtard, for the link to a very informative thread at Arnies Airsoft forum, so far this has been my main source of information on this replica. Multiple posters in the preceding link have the same problems, I do not expect to be any different.

The first issue is, The box magazine SUCKS. I have tested mine by just running BBs through it into the bag, NOT connected to the gun. It does not constantly feed BBs though the feed tube with out rattling and shaking Apparently this is not usual as I have found no one that has this replica that has a box mag the feeds reliable and quickly enough to keep the replica when fired with a 9.6volt battery or on spring position 1 (more on that in a bit) There are two repairs for this.

The first is to use this motor a Tamiya Jr sprint Dash motor #15318. It is apparently a drop in replacement for the ammo drive motor. It is heavier duty, hi torque, and works at a higher voltage. The original motor is powered off 3 AA batteries held in the bottom of the box magazine, There is plenty or room for more batteries but adding a fourth battery or a 9volt battery usually not only smokes the stock motor but over heats and destroys the wiring as well. Currently I am leaning towards this solution after testing the stock magazine.


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The other Repair is to gut the box magazine of all STAR components and hack a MAG M249 cloth magazine mechanism into the bottom as a replacement. This has advantages in that it is spring assisted feed mechanism, which the STAR strangely is NOT. It is a proven magazine that feeds well. But requires that I spend $120 to cut up a magazine to make the change.

The next issue with this replica is the one that has me the most concerned. It will develop airseal leaks between the air seal and hop up chamber, My forum searching points out that this is not unusual with STAR mechanisms. What I have not found is a answer to solve it. I have PMed some members here but have not found any solutions yet. This is a support weapon so I expect that I will also develop this problem as well. Since the STAR M60 uses its own special mechbox design there are no drop in replacement mech boxes available. Although ARES is supposable working on a metal ball bearing mechbox, this has not been released yet.

Enough about expected problems, On wards to the replica! First, My experience with E hobby Asia was pretty good. I bought on line and four days latter, Christmas eve! it was delivered by some guy in a car (I am not kidding,) I have no idea how the heck it got here that fast, teleportation? maybe ballistic missile? It was not possible to track the shipment in transit. It came shipped in a olive paper shrouded HEAVY duty double walled cardboard box with a ethafoam cut out inside. This foam is so well done that I need to find a gun case and use the shipping foam to store the gun. Packaging was A++.

The M60E4/ Mk43 is the same replica, The difference between the two is in the flash hider and the the style of fore grip or rail system included. Upon picking it up, I expected it to be a lot heavier than it was. I think its lighter than a CA M249 that I have handled in the past. However, it is a support gun it is not a M4 so smaller players may find it is a bit unwieldy. I ordered a M60 style padded sling, I suggest any purchaser does as well.

The replica it self is made of ballistic nylon, and aluminum mostly, There are some plastic components but these are the exception. It is finished in a broad spectrum of greys and blacks with appropriate metallic components. There are trade marks that while not perfect for the real steel guns are close enough. Both the Mk43/ and the M60E4 are Short or cut down versions of the standard M60 Machine gun. The bipod is fitted to the gas tube and folds down securely in either position. The bipod legs also extend for length. The sights are functional, fold and adjustable. The carry handle, other owners have complained about but mine seems to be fairly secure at this time. I am pretty sure that the "carry handle" is actually meant to expedite changing out a hot worn out barrel on the real steel M60, as such I don't think it is supposed to bear the weight of the gun anyway.

Along with the box magazine and flash hider a small section of plastic toy like false 7.62 ammo belt is included. It is placed across the feed tray which opens the same way a real on does and placed on top of the lid of the box magazine. I have a dummy belt of the real thing but it is so well hidden it is all but unnoticeable. On thing that was not in the box. Instructions. these are available from STARS web site as a PDF but I am going to post them soon for reference as well. http://www.starairsoft.com/

The battery case is located under the feed tray it is cavernous, It easily swallows the 9.6 4800 mah batteries. In fact in could almost carry your spare sub-c battery pack. Also under the feed tray cover is the gear box. Yes, it is clear poly carbonant, it is not the same as STARS problematic M249 gearbox so the after market gear boxes made for their SAW will not fit, however, someone at arnies says it is possible to hack on in if you have to, I find that reassuring. The gearbox does use metal and in some cases ball bearing bushings, I do not know what size as I am resistant to dive into it until I fire it and chrono it. One of the odd things about this gear box is it has a two position spring setting. position 1 has less fps but a higher rate of fire. position 2 shortens the springs stroke for a higher fps at expense of cyclic rate. Spring position 2 is equivalent in length to a normal AEG, The spring inside is longer than normal. I will not know how this performs until I get the replica out to the field. Several other users at arnie report that inside a XYZ hi speed gears. I will no more and confirm this information later when I get up the gumption to open the gearbox and check the shimming. Again I want to see if it works and get some field time before I go slay internal dragons. The hop up is adjusted with a allen wrench just forward of the rear sight. I can not comment on how it performs at this time.

The replica came shipped with a abused orange M16 style cheap plastic bird cage suppressor attached. That was glues on with non-removable lock tight. No matter how big a wrench I used it would not surrender its grip on the muzzle. I finally used a mixture of brute strength, subtly, and delicate use of dremel tool, exacto saw, number 11 exacto knifes and channel locks. This pretty much destroyed the orange flash hider, such as life. In its place a aluminum bird mouth flash hider which was included was spun on. This is made of aluminum and looks fantastic.

In all Externally, This is a fantastic replica, it is metal, looks mean, I have no complaints about its appearance or function. Internally, I am concerned, time will tell. The box mag is definitely where STAR dropped the ball, that will need some attention probably before I even chrono it.

Photos will be posed as soon as my camera charges _______________________________________

I finally have a charge on my Camera, enjoy the pictures.
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I got some field time in today, chroned a solid 335 340,342 fps in spring position 1. Rate of fire was good, box mag fed but needed shaken a lot. I am defiantly going to re motor it. For those that missed it this AEG has two positions for the gear box spring, position 1 is longer and more relaxed increasing rate of fire at the expense of velocity.
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I am still worried about the gear box, From what I have read on other airsoft forums that this replica develops air seal and nozzle issues over time, 80% of the replicas reviewed also have piston/ shimming issues. I MAY have gotten one that has decent quality control, I really will not know until I run a lot more BBs thru it. One of the other problems I was told to expect is if I were to upgrade it to very high velocity or rate of fire the constant hammering of the piston may crack the poly carbonate gearbox case. This is especially true if I were to put a aluminum piston, piston head, cylinder head in it. Right now I am doing lot of research on what internal upgrades it takes. The gear box is proprietary to this replica so finding out what upgrades it takes is not easy. Internally it is the same as the more popular M249s by most account which I think takes version 2 internals and version 6 nozzles but I am not positive enough of this information to make a purchase. What I am considering is to run this replica stock while building a upgraded gear box to drop in when it fails. I am running the spring in rate of fire position with lower fps so as not to stress the gear box. The problem is the box mag can NOT feed fast enough to keep up the mechanism even with 8.4 volt batteries instead of the recommended (and preferred ) 9.6 volt batteries that I normally use in a support replica. I really need to order that tamiya motor mentioned and remotor the box magazine. I really SHOULD at least open the mech box up and reshim and grease it but as long as it stays consistent in fps and makes no noise I am not going to borrow trouble by cracking it open.
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Update:

For those that have been living under a rock. ARES used to produce replicas for STAR, They have decided to cut STAR out and produce replica under their own brand. The replicas are the same but have been revisited internally. The ARES M60 is currently around $450 right now but you gain a metal gearbox and a improved box magazine which is supposed to fix the two biggest issues with this replica. Although ARES has told me that they will not guarantee 100% compatibility, I have no doubt that they will work.

I have been in contact with ARES HK and Ares USA looking for their metal gear box and improved box magazines, They responded in three days to my inquiry with a list of US retailers. Of the 10 retailers they suggested NONE of them carry ARES replacement parts yet. So the Email run around continues. I know that they are available as I know of at least one other user has gotten his hands on the gearbox and box magazine and raves about the difference. He has upgraded his to greater than 400fps (420fps with .20s or so and 30 rounds per second) Much higher than I am willing to but his will be a good guide on what explodes internally and what upgrades are available.

After the last LP game, I barely used the M60 as its feed problems caused a lot of dry fires on the range, It ended up back in its case for the day, but not before another replica that was propped up next to the jeep fell over and impacted the plastic feed tray. This is normally protected by the rear cover and is decorative in nature. However I was removing the battery to use in another replica and left the cover open. The impact scored a direct hit on the feed tray breaking it in four pieces. I removed and repaired this with Plastruct plastic weld. This is a very aggressive plastic solvent cement. It worked very well on the ABS plastic feed tray, but be warned that if you use this solvent use it in very small quantities. I have not reinstalled the feed try of faux bullets.

I just finished modding my box magazine with a Tamiya Jr sprint Dash motor ($5) and a 4X AA battery holder from radio shack ($2) So with the clouds of solder and flux stinking up my room I finished the electric install. While I was in the box magazines mechanism I cleaned the goop out of the nylon gears and re greased it with Labelle 106 PTFE white grease. This is a plastic compatible grease used for the gear boxes of large scale (Garden) model trains (I collect expensive hobbies as a hobby apparently)

Something that the guide I re-posted does not mention is the depth although there is a lot of surface area inside the box magazine the depth is very tight because of the way the mechanism sits inside the box magazine. I ended up cutting and grinding out the box magazines lid with careful use of a dremel motor tool and Exacto knifes to remove internal bracing that keeps the battery holder (original) from shifting around inside. Even with the bracing trimmed out the lid is a very tight fit, Ever so slightly bowing at the bottom.

What this gained me is a little more oomph in the feed. It is still prone to fits and starts while just running BBs through the magazine back into the bag but it is much better than it was stock. My next test will to run some BBs through the replica in the super secrete testing range located in my basement out of public eye. It is my hope that it will be found usable at the next LP game I make it to.


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I just realized that I did not re post the box magazine rebuild guide here, my error is now corrected below:

Box magazine re motor over on airsoftforum.com by James Bernatchez

"Hey Jeep, that is fine! I wrote with the intention of trying to help people with their issues so fee free to repost it." jamesbernatchez


I posted a link but here it is reposted entirely for reference.

STAR M60 Box Mag Mod How-To
by: James Bernatchez
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Most people who own or have seen a Star M60 fire found them to misfire a great deal, even on an 8.4v battery. There hasn't been any upgrades from Star so people have found it is up to themselves to figure out a way to modify the magazine to feed reliably. Now, I take no responsibility if you mess up your magazine. This is just for information purposes only. If you do not think you can do this, find somebody who is comfortable doing it for you.

Even after changing out to a 9v battery I found my M60 to misfire a BB far to much for my liking. Others have said the same. One person on the forum thinks the answer is the motor. He said after installing one of these Tamiya motors it is now feeding great! Now it isn't that bad and is skirmishable as is, but I am not able to leave well enough alone. I must enhance its performance. Please note, that a stock box mag differs from the one in the photos as I have already added a pressure switch and the 9v battery to mine.

First things first the parts list. In order to complete this task you will need:
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-STAR M60 Box Mag
-Pressure Switch (NC Star is the brand I have and I picked it up on ebay for $10 shipped)
-Tamiya Jr 4wd Motor (I have 3 available Power Dash, Hyper Dash 2, and Sprint Dash)
-9v Battery Harness (I am using one from Radio Shack)
-9v battery
-18AWG High strand count copper wire (16AWG would be smaller and easier to use)
-Small Phillips head screwdriver
-Wire strippers
-Scissors
-Shrink wrap
-Soldering Iron (I recommend an 80 watt iron)
-60/40 Rosin Core Solder



Disassembly

1.) Flip the box mag over and remove the four phillips head screws. Remove the bottom cover and be careful not to lose the screws.
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2.) Locate the 2 phillips head screws marked and remove them. With these removed you will be able to take out the motor/bb assembly from the box magazine. NOTE: I already have the pressure switch installed as well as the 9v battery. If your box mag is stock you will have to remove the 3 AA batteries and there will be one screw holding in the battery holder. Once that is done you will see the on/off switch which is held in with hot glue. Use a flat head screw driver to loosen the glue from the side of the box mag. This will allow you to slide the switch out. Remove that and then you can remove the two screws to take the motor/bb assembly out. Don't worry, you can remove the whole assembly without worry, it is screwed together so nothing will fall apart.
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3.) The screw arrowed in the box mag holds the BB feed tube in place. This does NOT need to be removed. It can stay. In the photo below you can see there is no on/off switch on my harness. This is because I had the pressure switch installed and it can not fit through the slot in the mag, so I had to snip it. It isn't a problem because it would all need to be soldered again anyways.
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4.) Now to remove the motor. Remove the two screws arrowed and that will allow to to take off the motor holder and motor.

5. For reference, you can see a three pronged switch that I have arrowed. What happens is that BB's are fed under this switch, up through the BB tube into the hop up. If you are not firing the gun the BB's will stop and the switch will be depressed which will shut off your motor so you don't burn it up. You can see that two red wires are soldered to it. The "A" wire goes to one side of the on/off or pressure switch. The "B" wire goes to the positive side on the motor. The switch is basically a closed circuit. When no BB's are pushing it, the motor is connected to the switch so when you press it or turn it on, the motor feeds BB's. When the BB's press it on, the switch opens and cuts power to the motor.

===NOTE=== This owner already upgraded to box mag to a 9volt battery in place of 3 AAs that is factory The factory box mag's wiring and motor is not up to this, you will smoke the factory stuff.
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6.) Here is the pinion gear on the new Tamiya motor. It is a press fit pinion gear so you only need a flat head to slide it off of the old shaft. Once off just push it onto the new shaft. Done! For reference, the motors say to use them with 2.4v - 3v. I plan on running 9v through them as I have heard they can take it. Only usage will be able to tell me if that is the case. You might be wondering what is the difference between the three motors. The only difference that I can see is the RPM that they spin at. The Power Dash spins at 19,900 RPM. The Sprint Dash spins at 20,700 RPM. The Hyper Dash 2 spins at 17,200 RPM. NOTE: these RPMs are measured with the proper voltage being 2.4v -3v. They should spin a great deal faster on 9v. I plan to wire up the box mag in this how-to with 9v, but I plan to wire up my other mag with a 4 AA holder. If they both work I plan to run it on 4 AAs as it should have less wear and tear than with the 9v battery.
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7.) Now it is time to cut the 18AWG wires to the size you need. Just put them up next to the existing wires and cut them to the same size. If using a pressure switch and battery box, you will need a short red wire from the motor to the switch, a long red wire from the switch to one side of the pressure switch and a black wire from the motor to the negative wire on the battery harness.

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8.) Now, using your wire strippers, remove the ends of each side in order to get them ready to be soldered.

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9.) Now that the wires are ready we need to get the motor and bb gear assembly ready. Desolder the red wires from the switch. You do NOT need to desolder the black or red wire from the motor because you arn't reusing it right now.

10.) With the above complete, we need to tin each end of the exposed wires as well as the two tabs on the motor. Just a little solder will do. This is to help the solder flow together when you go and attach the wires.

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11.) Attach the black wire to the negative tab on the motor, which happens to be on the left side. Attach the short red wire to the post labeled "A" and the positive motor tab labeled "A". Last, you want to attach the long red wire on the left most post of the switch. You can see in the second photo that the black wire will go to the negative side of the battery connector and the red wire will go to one side of either the on/off switch or pressure switch.

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12.) In the photo below I have attached the negative wire of the battery connector to the negative wire coming off the motor. I used a small piece of shrink wrap to insulate the connection.
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13.) Now here is the pressure switch wiring. Inside of the outer insulating silicone there are two small wires, one red (positive) and one black (negative). First, forget what is which. It does not matter. Both of these will be attached to the positive side of the wiring. We do this because when the pressure switch is not pressed, nothing will happen. Once we press the pressure switch it completes the flow of electricity and will in turn power the motor. So it is the opposite of the switch inside the motor/bb assembly. It is open when it is not pressed and closed when it is pressed.
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NOTE: Before finally attaching the pressure switch to the battery harness and the internal switch you should double check that your motor is turning in the right direction. With the motor in the motor holder and you looking down on the motor the pinion gear should spin COUNTER CLOCKWISE. In order to test hold the wires to the wires they should be attached to. Then, give the pressure switch a quick fast push. If the gears wind as they should you should be fine. If nothing happens you might need to reverse the two wires on the motor.

14.) After tinning the two wires on the pressure switch (remember, this is just coating them with a small amount of solder) we want to attach one end to the long red wire from the switch and the other end to the red (positive) wire coming from the battery harness. Don't forget to slip a piece of shrink wrap over the wire BEFORE soldering them. Then slip the shrink wrap over the adjoining wires and shrink it with a lighter. Tuck the wiring in the side of the box, put the motor/bb assembly in place and make sure none of the wiring is in the way. It should slide back down relatively easily. Do NOT forget to put the two screws that hold the assembly back in. The 9v should fit above this with ease. Screw on the bottom cover, load up some BB's and get to testing! NOTE: If you are using a 4 AA holder you will need to use a dremel to remove some of the webbing on the inside of the bottom cover in order to get it to sit flush.

15. After completing this I loaded up about 1,500 BBs, put the battery in the gun, attached the box mag to the gun and went outside. I found that the motor spun faster and sounded like it had more torque. Upon shooting it I was happy with the mod. Because the mag isn't spring loaded to always keep pressure on the BBs it will NEVER feed 100%. With the new motor and wiring I had far less misfires than previously, although they still did occur. I had my girlfriend count out 5 seconds while during that time I held the trigger and pressure switch down until she told me the time was up. I would guestimate that I fired 100 to 150 rounds....with only about 6 misfires. There was some bursts of 3-4 seconds that I had no misfires and some that had 2 or 3 quickly.

I do think this mod is an improvement, but unless they design a spring loaded box mag they will never feed 100%. For the total cost of this mod it is well worth it! Even if it didn't help the feeding, knowing I have a high quality Tamiya motor as well as thicker wiring has made me feel more comfortable using the mags for an extended time. I hope this was helpful and useful for everyone!
Last edited by Jeep on Tue Mar 17, 2009 8:57 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby KA-BAR » Tue Mar 17, 2009 8:50 am

i purchased some of Ians work before he got the CnC mill.

i was a lil dissapointed, but. i am sure his work now is satisfactory, i guess.

because Ian is not a player, i belive he builds conceptual replicas, that are not sturdy enuff for field use.

can you take it to a game and shoot it? sure.....is it durable enuff to last the abuses of milsim? guess you will have to find out like i and the duke did.



nice review, its been a long time comming for someone to put one together.


nominated for a sticky.




KA-BAR out
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Postby Jeep » Tue Mar 17, 2009 9:12 am

I can't comment on airsharp's M2 build quality yet, I ordered on July 10th and don't have it yet. Although, it should be here very soon.
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Postby Pulsipher » Tue Mar 17, 2009 1:50 pm

Good read
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Postby Beran » Tue Mar 17, 2009 3:54 pm

you sir, are my hero. i got my STAR Mk43 recently (got it for a steal too, because the box mag wasnt working) and spent some time and money getting the magazine more or less functional. then the hopup took a dump, and now that ive hopefully fixed that my plan is to run it with an M110 until something explodes and then replace the gearbox with the ARES one. so far (when it shoots) it shoots great with the M110. i keep three (yes, three. they all fit comfortably) mini 8.4v 1200mah batteries in the stock and it was getting probably 2000 rounds or so out of one battery with the stock spring before i upgraded it. i havent experienced much in the way of air nozzle compression issues, but then like i said i havent tested it with the new bucking yet. the stock one was horrible, it was thin and not nearly as sturdy as it should have been. like i was saying, it kept grabbing the bb as it passed through and folding back on itself and jamming the gun. once i test the new bucking ill update, but if it works well ill be very happy with the gun itself.
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Postby Nec » Tue Mar 17, 2009 5:05 pm

KA-BAR wrote:nominated for a sticky.
KA-BAR out


+1 Jeep, you know your shit!
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Postby DMitri » Tue Mar 17, 2009 5:38 pm

There's a magical thread where you don't need to nominate stickies. ;)
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Postby Jeep » Wed Mar 18, 2009 10:14 pm

Since I threw my M60 review in. I might as well but up my RPK review as well. This was posted to C3airsoft. milsimempire and ASF as well.

Thu Aug 30, 2007 10:30 pm_____________________________________________________________

This is a on going review that I started early last year and posted to c3airsoft.com. It may seem a little disjointed because of this. It does show some wear and tear over at least of months, draw your own conclusions.

WIKI for the real steel RPK http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RPK

9/01/07 Purchasing the gun

I purchased and used a TSD Tactical Gen II Full Metal/Wood RPK today at Linglestown Paintball. This is a review thread for this AEG. I plan on adding to this thread as I gain some more experience and use with it, as I test is longevity and wear.

I purchased this airsoft gun at Airsoft GI for $365 http://www.airsoftgi.com/product_inf...oducts_id=2335)

Initial impressions:

It is a very solid AEG with no wobbles or shoddy construction at this time. I do not think it is excessively heavy (15 .lbs or so) as I carry my TM M14 along with it all day and on several occasions handled it one handed. It is nearly entirely made from metal (alloy) with wood furniture. The flash suppressor is painted a very bright orange per regulations. It is equipped with a metal bipod and comes with a TM Hi cap (600 BBs) and a metal, powered 3000+ BB drum mag. The drum mag holds its mechanism, 4 AAA batteries and more than 3000 BBs. I dumped a 5000 BB bag in and had just a few left over for two AK high caps and two pistol magazines. There is a external switch to activate the advance with is powered by 4 AAA batteries. I noticed that with long full automatic fire you need to hold your pink finger out to advance the magazine or it will dry fire. I had no problems with BBs and no problems with jams using .20 gram made by KSC, Excel and tippman. The AEG chronographs a solid 380 to 385 and sustained that through the day. It is a little loud compared to my TM M14. It is a little longer than my M14 as well but the extra barrel length coupled with a decent hop up bucking gives it really good range.

The RPK has a Reinforced Metal Toyko Marui style ver 3 Gearbox that includes steel gears, steel bushings, and a ported piston. It is compatible with TM internals and magazines. It takes a 8.4 large type battery. This is held in the hollowed our wooden stock and sealed with a metal and plastic cover, (which I lost at Linglestown) The hop up is adjustable and seemed to allow some gradual tuning but I by no means a expert on this. The BBs were going where they need to though. The drum mag and coupled with a advertised 600 BB per minute allow definite fire superiority to be established.

To wrap up, I have had a positive experience with it thus far. Even though it is a odd manufacture (TSD and SRC). It is compatible with TM parts and mechanisms. For $365 it is a good buy at this point. I will post a small picture as soon as possible.

Currently, I do not know any disadvantage to it other than its size, and it is smaller and lighter than most support weapons so this could be seen as a plus.

http://www.airsoftgi.com/product_inf...oducts_id=2643



Sat Sep 01, 2007 7:53 pm______________________________________________________________

10/28/07 Impressions from the Big game with c3 airsoft:

I initially had a lot of problems with it. Some of the guys form 1st CAV airsoft helped me trouble shoot it back to battery problems. They ended up loaning me a 9.6 battery (thanks SPARTAN) I was initially a little Leary of such a big battery into a clone. It solved all the issues, ROF went way up. FPS jumped back up to 380 as it chronoed low at the start of the game. When I got it up on the top of the dirt pile above the berms field it was dominating until we got flanked, This coincided with the battery powered drum's battery wearing down. Even with Hi cap Ak mags it was really capable of sustaining fire into its zone of coverage. So far so good. I am going to order some 9.6 of my own since SPARTAN need his back. (I have since ordered some 9.6s of my own, they work great with this replica)

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10/27 Game at LP.

For this game the RPK has now been fitted with a proper flash suppressor which is available as parts from TSD or some retailer, This replaces the stock m16 style bird cage flash suppressor that this replica comes with stock. I now own my own 9.6volt battery, this made the mechanism wake up and TURN. I am very pleased with the increase in Rate of fire and battery life.

The RPK worked flawlessly for me with one exception and that was my fault. I fell kind of hard with it and dislodged a battery form the inside of the powered drum magazine. (takes 4 AAA batteries) During the lunch break I fixed this and tested it and promptly broke a wire off. I'll solder it up next time my iron is out. I played all day using AK high caps with no I'll effect or feed problems. Notice in the pictures that the back of the gun is covered with 100 mph tape. It is very easy to lose the back plates on AK series replicas. This is what happened to mine, Its out on LP's fields (camp cody field) somewhere.

_____________________________________________________________
11/03/07 Repairing the wires

I soldered up the wires but ended up replacing the push button on the magazine with another one from radio shack, the repair cost about $1.19.

__________________________________________________________


This past weekend, My RPK gave fantastic service to my platoon. (which also had a Tanaka M249 and a TM G3 with a auto-winding drum), guess that makes us a weapons platoon. biggrin.gif . The drum mag has needed to be rewired and a new switch installed. This is due to my complacences than any error with the manufacture. It is a straight froward repair. Using a new radio shack push button and some heavier wire. The RPKs performance degraded slightly with FPS dropping wo around 375 for this game. This may be due to the fact that it was in the low 40s at the warmest on Sunday and the batteries were not completely charged.

___________________________________________________________

11/26/07

Just a note that I am ending this review, My RPK was damaged beyond easy repair yesterday. I left it propped against a rock at Poco Loco paintball down in the swamp, someone taking cover behind said rock banged against it and snapped the stock off. I can not fault the accident or the manufacture of the AEG as this would have damaged any replica in the same situation.
If I find away to repair this AEG, I post it up.
__________________________________________________________________________________

Edit: These are good alternatives to the tsd RPK replica. They may end up as a way for me to repair my broken one.
http://www.redwolfairsoft.com/redwolf/a ... odID=22667
http://www.redwolfairsoft.com/redwolf/a ... odID=17658

These are conversion kits for marui AK47s made by Inokatsu and Guarder. I will post up anything else I find as I am looking for bits and pieces to repair mine.
and these parts that I found at Gunner:

http://www.gunnerairsoft.com/catalog/pr ... cts_id=502

http://www.gunnerairsoft.com/catalog/pr ... cts_id=381

http://www.gunnerairsoft.com/catalog/pr ... cts_id=597
http://www.gunnerairsoft.com/catalog/pr ... cts_id=205

__________________________________________________________________________________

3/05/08 Update:

I am including this information in case someone else has problems with a TSD Tactical airsoft replica. I have spend the last couple of months looking at after market bodies for the RPK. I can not say for sure if any of the available AK bodies would work on the TSD/SCR RPK. Most of the bodies that I looked at had subtle differences in how the stock attached to the body, Apparently having the stock snap off is fairly common with this replica. I was considering using a G&G para body to make a para RPK but after I was in contact with Hotspot to do the repair, it was suggested to me to send it back to the manufacture.
I contacted TSD at their website at http://www.tsdtactical.com/ then by phone at :
Phone:
(626) 281-0979

I was then referred to the repair department at 1 (323) 981-0013 given a RV number and a estimate of $102 for repair and return The breakdown is $30 hour labor, $50 replacement parts and the rest in shipping. My RPK was boxed up and shipped to the below address (below) including one magazine for testing. It should arrive on Monday the 10 of March and I expect in back sometime in April but I'll know more once its looked at. Considering most of the After market replacement bodies I priced were between $50 and $300 it is more than reasonable for repair/rebuild. I am currently waiting disposition:

Mailing Address:
901 South Fremont Ave
Unit 218
Alhambra, CA. 91803

_____________________________________________________________
May 08 Receiver the replica back from TSD tactical, Not only did they repair the broken body, They did a complete service and rebuild to my replica. Including a gearbox service and reshim. This is probably why my velocity was fluctuating earlier. Just to be clear bigger batteries do not have any real influence on velocity, just rate of fire. However TSD replicas seem to have some resistance in their mechanism either electrical or maybe mechanical. They all work much better with 9.6 volt batteries.

________________________________________________________________


7/05/08

Sadly, The RPK had another lower receiver failure. I was not even stressed when the tangs on the back of the body that hold the stock on broke off AGAIN!. I may look into a aftermarket body after all as it is obvious that the stock one is not up to be skirmished with unless you are very very careful with it.
______________________________________________________________


I should have updated this review several months ago, sorry I neglected it. :?

I ordered a G&P STEEL AK47 body and have now installed it, repairing the RPK making it field ready again. This replacement body is all but identical with the exception on a slightly different stock end that is a little stronger and some of the metal is a little thicker, This does not effect the fit much. The G&P body is a dull powder coated steel lazer cut body it is noticeably heavier than the aluminum alloy body that has now broken twice now. The photos below show the internals and the body swap, it took about a two hours and I have not done a body swap before, The MECHBOX.COM AK47 assemble/disassemble videos :rail:
are spot on for the break down:

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------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
12/12/08

G&P metal lower receiver just failed the same way as the original, Instead of breaking completely off the upper tang deflected and only the bottom tang separated. I have ordered another lower receiver from E hobbies Asia.
____________________________________________________________
1/03/09

Game at LP, still going strong with its second G&P body (number 4 over all) With the length of the replica, the extra leverage on the stock seems to stress the lower receiver more. Stocks breaking off regular length AKs are not that unusual. Its kind of inevitable that RPKs will have issues here

Real sword and Classic Army have entered the field with their own RPK replicas. The Real sword is more realistic with a RPK bulge on the lower receiver. Honestly, I never noticed the bulge is missing so only someone that has experience with the real RPK firearm would probably notice.
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Re: Jeep's guide on Support gun replicas and mini review:

Postby Mono » Thu Mar 26, 2009 7:59 pm

Jeep wrote:If is far more important for a support replica to feed consistently and for long periods of time (15 secs or so per burst).


... What?
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Well, uh... Yes, that will happen.
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Why a support gun?

Postby Jeep » Sat Mar 28, 2009 9:36 pm

The role.

The objective of the support gunner is to suppress your opponents, defend an area, or to take out a large group of enemies. As a support gunners in airsoft long burst of suppressive fire are used to drive back opponents back into cover, this gives your team mates time to move in relative safety (provided you can keep them suppressed) This is also
useful in defense situations because of their rate of fire that they can shoot at an enemy can establish fire superiority never giving your opponents to shoot back effectively. This is one of the most important job of a gunner, to force an enemy into a position of defense that benefits their teammates. The importance of the gunner is not to be fast and maneuverable, but to hold key areas of the battlefield for a period of time. The thing about suppressive fire is that you don't need a SAW/LMG. It can be done with just a few rounds at the right placement and timing. But, this often takes multiple AEG working in concert to get the same effect as one upgraded SAW. The best suggestion to you on how to keep your opponents heads down is this: Hammer anything that makes a lot of noise. Drums, tin sheeting, ect. patter rounds off the noisiness cover you can reach and all around them, you will either drive them to the ground or in some case demoralize them to such a extent as to drive them out of perfectly good cover.

The replica

Some groups and especially events only allow high caps, Cmags and powered drums only on common machine gun replicas. Battle rifles and SMGs are limited in these games to midcaps or low caps.

The SAW by itself and un-upgraded is little more than a big, heavy unwieldy AEG provides little to no advantage over an AEG battle rifle unless it is made to be able to handle a massive amount of firing. This is very hard on airsoft replicas internally. Sustained fire can erode trigger contacts. Over heat bearings, burn out motors, shred pistons, and strip gears. Not to mention being able to feed BBs reliably to keep up with the sustained rate of fire the role needs. This is where upgrading and manufacture's design comes in.

There are some advantages to some of the support gun replicas however compared to other AEGs. These can be in the gearbox design (8mm ball bearings, reinforced gearboxes) and in some cases the spring system, which can be removed and swapped out without really even opening the gun up. I prefer a more moderate support gun replica that is upgraded with reliability in mind, Try to use big ball 8mm bearings in the mechbox also use bearing spring guides all help reduce friction and internal stresses which can even lead to gear box cracking. I do not build my support guns to very high velocities or extreme rates of fire, In fact I do not even put tight bores in most of them. (although I do go for high quality hop up buckings) Remember the goal here is to be able to control a area for a period of time. Patter BBs off a area of cover and keep your opponents heads down. In fact I even go so far as for mix BB weights in my drum magazines to accentuate a BB fall pattern. (70% .20, 20% .25s. and 10% .30 in my RPK at 380fps with .20) The heavier BBs give you a little better brush busting capability if you play in a lot of heavy cover.

Box magazines need to tested so they feed at the required rates the mech box is capable of cycling. The goal here is to sustain a rate of fire for upwards of 15 seconds. This gives your team mates 15 seconds + enemy reaction time to break cover and move to a new position. It is also 15 second that a teammate can use to fumble for a magazine, reload and be ready to fire again.

That said there are lots of players that upgrade to the point where they CAN fire very high rates of fire AND at fairly high velocities, but there replicas are notoriously unreliable and the expense of upgrading to be able to do this is very very expensive. A broken or unreliable replica is a liability when your team mates are relying on the support gunner for suppressive fire. However when these replicas work they will do a slightly better job than my more moderate builds, but the differences in performance are not really that big.
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Postby Jeep » Thu May 07, 2009 12:29 am

And now some machineGUN whoring

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Still working on some odds and ends while I wait for a chance to get out to the field.

I have ordered ball bearing spring guides for the M60E4 and M249, they are back ordered. I also ordered a railed feed cover for the M60 and added a spare red dot scope. The M249 got a 8 inch length of dummy ammo. I am working on a ammo can holder for the M2 then I'll have a chance to field it. The RPK gained a much needed AK type sling. All replicas are currently functioning.
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Postby Variable » Thu May 07, 2009 12:51 am

Holy Crap dude.

Love the writeup.
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