California Senate Bill 798, what can we do?

[Catch22]

Fine then you provide the sole field for youth training and education, and all of the barred minors can come to your doorstep to play. That way, you can take all of the responsibility for their smallest mistakes.

Trust me I won't be alone in helping them. Look at the ATA training for new members, that I was apart of last year. I'm hoping to do more of it this year aswell. You'd be surprissed how many kids are actually good people and good players. Kinda hard for you to see that tho, from your ivory tower.

[KA-BAR]

Wow.. again.

You guys really want a Nanny-State?

I would much rather give the kids a place to play and learn the propper way of treating replicas. Then to ban them and have them playing in parks and empty fields. Shutting them out and being elitists will ensure hazardous situations. Followed by government control. And I don't want either.

Quit being a bunch of internet chodes. You guys aren't like this in person.


Wrong! These things are TOYS!!!

i dont want a nanny statye, but because the people who run this industry, this site and the games we go to , couldnt grow the sack to exclude minors at games, and allowed them into the community is the exact reason why uncle sam has to step in and do the job you were unwilling to do or just didnt have the heart to do..... or just plain ignored because you made money off it. so since you cant do the job and police up your community....ill say it again kevin.... uncle sam has no problem doing it for you.



and if you think airsoft guns are toys, well then you are part of the mentality that guns are toys and well that is just shameful....have fun with that one. part of the problen, not part of the solution....so yea, since you cant do it......the taxpayers will pay uncle sam to do it for you.


toys dont take out your teeth or do permenant eye damage... so if you are comfortable letting kids play with what you consider toys that are harmful in a unsupervised manner, then maybe your moral compass is a little off. maybe...if you really think that way, you shouldnt own real firearms. because i dont treat my airsoft weapons as toys, i treat them as they should be treated....like a replica firearm....not a toy.


i see that you still dont get it. you will when it slaps you in the face.

[Catch22]

KA-BAR, you see kids as the problem. The truth of the matter is... I've never seen a kid yelling "shazaam you in the neck" across a field. The fights I've seen were adults. Injuries came from adults being unsafe. Adults are more dangerous than any kid playing .

[KA-BAR]

you are right....but i have never seen a adult point a airsoft replica at a cop, unless that cop is pacman or sheepdog and they are at a game.


kids play airsoft where ever they want to....there is a thousand youtube vids to show that KIDS, not adults do stupid shit with airsoft replicas.



so really, whos fault will it be if major changes happen in the hobby you love....the fact that you couldnt bring your self to exclude minors from participating un supervised.... and look at the monster of self entitlement it has created.


i like you alot kevin, i enjoy playing on the field with you, and i appreciate you as a father taking the time to spend the day with your kid doing something you both love to to as a father and son...together.

its not that way with every kid. some kids probably dont have fathers and a single mother wont come play with her kid because she doesnt want to get a$$ raped by a bunch of divorcee over the hill airsofters behind the bushes <--- sound familliar tool diegal?

or the kids parent just dont give a shit about them and let them do what ever they want to.



the majority of the youth we play with brother doesnt fit into the same catagoty that you do.



maybe we need more dads like you.....just that they think airsoft replicas are that, and not toys :smiley:

[Catch22]

Just because I think of it as a toy. Dosen't mean I don't think there are dangers involved with using it incorrectly. Just like a skateboard or bike can be dangerous. They are still toys.

[nb]

Just because I think of it as a toy. Dosen't mean I don't think there are dangers involved with using it incorrectly. Just like a skateboard or bike can be dangerous. They are still toys.

+1.

There's a reason why Legos and other small toys say, "WARNING: Choking hazard, not for children under XX age."
Many toys can be harmful in an unsupervised or inappropriate manner.

Just saying.

[Ivan Daylovich™]

Airsoft guns are toys. Their entire purpose is entertainment. No definition of the word toy says that it is safe. Kids hurt and kill themselves with toys. I don't know why people think they can't be hurt by toys. As a kid I proved that wrong constantly.

Does anyone think that making these guns brightly colored will make the children playing with them safer?
I think it will have the opposite effect. Police will not (and should not) assume they are fake and trust their lives to that assumption. However parents will think that since it's brightly colored it will obviously be recognized as a toy and will be more likely to let there children play with them unsupervised, and in dangerous locations. Children will also be more likely to think that it is safe to point the airsoft guns at random people.

[KA-BAR]

here.... this shotgun is REAL.

its painted bright fire engine red and royal blue. it looks lie a toy gun. if a cop becomes desensitized by bright colors...and belives that if he sees them its a harmless replica or a toy... it could cost him his life. it doesnt matter if its bright and friendly looking a cop just might shoot your kid for pointing it at him. why, because the kid is a idiot shazaam and belives its just a toy, and he is playing cops and robbers, and he wants to be robert dinero for the day and play heat. either way its a cop who winds up dead on poor judgment or a kid who winds up dead on poor judgement.


nuff said.

[Ivan Daylovich™]

Exactly. So what's the point of making fake guns look like that?

[KA-BAR]

i say stricter laws and penalties should be placed on parents for negligence and no parental supervision. you cant punish the child. so i say punish the parents with heavy fines and possible criminal charges and possible loss of custody.

[Ivan Daylovich™]

Why can't you punish the child?

[KA-BAR]

because once they turn 18....its all expunged and taken off the record.

unless the do a hienous crime and hold up a bank with a airsoft gun, or scare someone so bad they go into cardiac arrest....or anything else malicious. they should be held accountable.


but i say double jepordy and penalize the parent also. then maybe parents will change the way they parent their kids....and we wont have to change how we play a game with replica firearms as adults.

[Catch22]

Pointing anything at a cop can get you shot. reaching for anything suddenly can get you shot. The problem isn't toy guns. The problem is doing dumb things around cops.

[Miracle]

Poo throwing doesn't help. Except KA-BAR's poo throwing, that seems to be rally point for you guys to discuss further, and that's good. Not saying I agree with everything he says. Not saying I disagree with everything either.

But the discussion is good. Try not to get emotional.

This.


Also Miracle, where the hell do you play? Around Ellensburg?

There is no airsoft community in Ellensburg. While I'm at school I only have time for the major 1st Sword events.

The community I keep mentioning is in Whatcom county. Bellingham, WA. WCASL. Very well policed because there are zero public fields that aren't paintball fields in Lynden and Bellingham. Therefore owners and teams are very prudent about who they allow onto the fields. While I no longer reside or play there, I still feel a strong connection to my old teammates and friends in that community (Ghost Tac).

And I apologize for mud-slinging. I just get frustrated by sweeping generalizations that are just opinions and don't actually help anyone or present any solutions. I stated my opinion on the UK regulations because I think we should adopt that system. And that is my solution.

[Haloeclipse]

People can take ownership of this game and community, or not. Instead of bitching about stoopid kids with improper guidance, man up and show them the ropes. Nanny state? Because theres been how many examples of effective nanny state approaches from the US government? Take your time answering I know it may take awhile to find. like any other additional government oversight and regulation, it most likely will stop nothing and simply add another level of stupidity. The best idea is to never encourage, even by proxy, stupid legislation, its hard enough preventing it in the first place.

This attitude of shazaam kids, blame the parents, I'm not their nanny causes the exact problems y'all are bitching about. You are worse than the parent that didn't teach them because you DO know better. This is an airsoft community, as in we should try and help eachother, not just ostracize or falsely blame the youngins. I've seen easily as many stupid adults as I have kids. Ive seen more kids just lookin to have a fun time at a game, than I have adults with there easily bruised ego.. You can't stop stupid but it is a moronic, simplistic, and ultimately, *wrong* answer to simply use minors as the scapegoat. Take a look at yourselves and ask, what have *I* done to better the community the hobby and those looking to get into it? It takes more than simply calling your hits or knowing how to build and operate a toy sniper rifle.