The Great Brand Debate

Discuss battery powered AEGs (Automatic Electric Guns) in this forum.

Postby Helo » Mon Mar 07, 2011 3:12 pm

JG- My first replica was their G36c, never gave me any trouble. Putting in an m4 tightbore and silencer made it a great field weapon.
Echo 1- Got their M16 RIS. Didn't give me any trouble until I tried to upgrade it. Didn't use the G36c or the M16 extensively enough to really get a feel for the quality.
G&P- M4 RIS, wonderful weapon. It stripped the piston after a few thousand rounds. Once that was replaced it's been perfect since.
Dboys- AK74U, best stock replica I've used so far but the gearbox really isn't able to handle 400 fps. Twice the grease has solidified and locked the gears, another time I've had parts break in the gearbox. 'Course that may have had something to do with mostly using it for suppressive fire ;)
Dboys AK74, just as good as the 74U with better accuracy. Haven't been playing with it enough to tell if it'll have gear issues or not.
With the Dboys AKs I would suggest ether reinforcing the the gears and piston or dropping the FPS to 380 or less.
Then again I prefer reliability to performance.
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Postby Junto » Mon Mar 07, 2011 3:23 pm

I'll always be a fan of just about everything Classic Army makes, but I will never be a fan of their G36 line. I poured far too much money into mine from the time I bought it new to keep it running and nothing ever worked. I finally resurrected and sold it, only to have it break down on the guy I sold it to at his first game with it. If you can't play with it and you can't sell it, it's garbage.
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Postby Shiloh » Mon Mar 07, 2011 3:42 pm

G&G: I own the GR15 raider (Read: A plain-jane M4 with an RIS unit) and love it. At first the pnuematic blowback seemed a little cheesy and kind of pointless, but its starting to grow on me. Nice chattering sound.

Internals appear solid, with my minimal amount of tech experience. Only thing I would think about upgrading at this point would be a TBB, and possibly the motor if I really wanted to bump up the ROF or torque. FPS is perfect for me, settled in right at 340. And that might even jump a bit when I get the tightbore.

Plastic body really surprised me. I was fully intent on buying a metal one soon after I recieved the gun, but found that the polymer body is shockingly sturdy. No wobble in the RIS at all, and just a tad in the crane stock. The only problem I have had so far is the damn swing swivel up front. This annoying little chunk of plastic keeps knocking against the metal barrel, making the most irritating clicking sound I've ever heard. Electrical tape or zip-ties are your friend, if you don't want to dissasemble your entire front sight.

TSD: Okay, I'll admit this isn't an AEG, so get off my back. But I own one of their 1014 replicas, and for the $50 I paid it can't be beat for a back-up/skirmish gun. Plastic body feels a little cheap, but hasn't given me any issues yet. Stock sucks, get some JB weld down the buffer tube or a suitable screwdriver (Torx head, I believe. Please correct me if I'm wrong.) to tighten it up. Shells are fun.

ICS: Like a few people already, I'll admit that my M4 was bought second-hand, from a retailer that claimed they had refurbished it. Stripped a pinion gear in under 1000 rounds, destroyed some wiring, and found it near impossible to interchange parts with other manufactures. Maybe their newer models have improved, but I'm still too skeptical to take a leap of faith on that.
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Postby Unconventional » Mon Mar 07, 2011 3:45 pm

+1 for G&P (minus their internals)

-1 for the CA G36 (nothing but problems with the trigger contact..etc)

CA was good for me about 75% of the time with the M4/M16 platform & gear boxes..etc...I really don't prefer CA anymore, though.

TM, G&P, VFC (not their internals, though), LCT, Avalon ..still top on my list of good brands that provide decent trademarks and are upgradeable with the many proven brands of upgrade parts.


Internal upgrade brands and external upgrade replica brands (not in order):

Systema
Prometheus
PDI
G&P
Madbull
Prime
PGC
Shooters Design
Nova
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Postby Patrick750 » Mon Mar 07, 2011 10:41 pm

okay time to vent

Echo 1- This brand is infamously known for re branding guns like JG. My very first gun was an E1 MP5K. It did it's job and I somehow managed to hold my ground at Ivan's farm with it. I took off the rails because i believed unscrewing 17 screws just to adjust the hop up and change a battery was a waste of time. It did what it was supposed to do and performed how an MP5K should preform. I used the super slow stock 8.4 it came with which means there wasn't a real easy way i could melt it down. My other experience with E1 was when a guy on my team was walking back to spawn and the stock of his new E1 m14 scout snapped off out of no where. My experiences have determined E1 to be hit or miss although the new platinum m4 and M28 they have released seem to be very well built guns.

KWA- First off let me tell you the externals of their AEG's look like crap to me (IMO) I do however have great things to say about their m9's. They have performed amazingly. The power they have is awesome and the new NS2 systems make the gas in one mag go way further then any others ive seen. The full metal design (besides barrel) makes it exact 1:1 replica in size and weight to the real thing. This should be a big +1 in any airsofters book. Although there is one problem that will make you shit your pants if you experience it. If you dry fire your m9 to much it will eventually wear down the welding/glue of the trigger spring royally bleeding up the gun. It will shoot full auto and expel all gas at once, its a terrifying site. Although once fixed the gun goes back to the amazing performance all kwa's seem to exhibit.

place holder for G&P, CA, and G&G guns. cause im to lazy to write them ATM
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Postby Russkie » Mon Mar 07, 2011 11:00 pm

Real Sword: I've owned a Type 56 since February 2010 and I have mixed feelings about it.

First, externals. Not really another mass produced airsoft gun that has this good of externals. It has real steel weight along with 1 to 1 spec externals. Nothing but thick high quality blued steel and nice real wood. Now, they could done better and picked a decent variant of an AK, but that's just me because I hate the look of the Type 56. To contrast that, though, is the Real Sword is compatible with real steel AK parts, so I was able to build an AKM out of it (and man it looks damn sexy). On the other hand I had to spend over a $120 just to do so.

Second, internals. It's a pretty solid design, but nothing special. The cylinder, cylinder head, piston head, plastic w/ metal bushing spring guide, 7mm ball bearings, and air nozzle are very standard, but they do the job well. I was very impressed with the piston and steel gears. The piston is polycarb with two metal teeth and can take one hell of a beating. The gears are standard ratio torque gears and are beefy. The gearbox shell is made of some heavy duty non magnetic metal and is reinforced. The shimming, lubing, and greasing was perfect stock which is a major plus. Now, the major con is that the wiring on the Real Sword is utter shit. I recommend completely scrapping it and rewiring it. The motor was also pretty bland. It's just a standard Chinaman Super High Torque motor and it eats batteries like crazy. I highly recommend replacing it with an Element Max Speed motor. The whole inner barrel/hop up assembly should be scrapped as well. It's a basic Chinaman made assembly and will turn crappy in about 6 months.

Last part I want to talk about is if it's worth the money. I think no, it's not. Why spend $370 on the gun and the have to spend another $150 or so just to make it shoot good? Instead you can get a full steel Dboys that will be just as fine for a hell of a lot cheaper (and it won't be a fugly Chinaman inbred AK47/AKM crossbreed crap Type 56).


WE: I owned a WE Baby High Capa 3.8 in Summer 2010 and have had experience on a couple other of their M1911 and High Capa variants.

Externally, they are decent. They use cheap aluminum and ABS plastic, but they feel solid. Overall, nothing too great and nothing horrible.

Internally, they are very basic and can be a bit of a POS at times. Your gas efficient fluctuates a lot. At times you can get 3 mags out on one fill and at other times one like half a mag before it shoots gas into your face. The magazines tend to freeze very easily. The barrel and hop up are very basic and give you sub par performance. Also, some of the internals tend to break more quickly than usual due to poor quality parts.

Overall, the great thing about them is they are relatively cheap. If you want to toy around with a GBB for the first time, this is a decent option. If you already know your stuff about GBB, then I recommend and you save up and get a KWA or a TM.
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Postby league 4 » Tue Mar 08, 2011 12:00 am

I've said it too much.... But, after going through 5+ G&P, 2 KWA, SRC, VFC, 2 CA, G&G,2 ICS, built from the ground up M4's, and a lot more (not counting any ACM), and working on almost all of them, I confidently say G&P beats the rest by far. Externals are commonly known to be the best, which I agree with being true. People say VFC is about equal but I disagree, the body is more like a CA being too smooth with kind of bad trades IMO. G&P also offers a LOT more variety externally with a ton of different AR platforms theres one for just about any preference or requirements as you could go from a stubby M4, up to M16's and XM110's. The internals are also easily my favorite. The metal cylinder head and nozzle get a perfect seal with the cylinder, and are also just as good as the best upgrade parts you could put in. The motor speaks for itself, the G&P M120 is used in tons of aftermarket builds, same with the piston and sometimes the piston head. The gears themselves are strong, I don't think I've ever had a G&P gear tooth strip, just the axles break which seems to be, or at least have been a pretty common problem. 8mm bearing gearbox shell, ball bearing spring guide, hopup holds its setting well, deans connectors are a HUGE plus... Inner barrel is nothing special but most people get tightbores anyways. The price starting at $250 for a basic M4 with crane stock is really appealing too. KWA has always had some of (if not the worst) externals of any high end manufacturer. the crane stock just feels bad, but it does use a kind of good design, but installing a MOSFET didn't look like fun. Magazine comparability is horrible... The only mags I could get to half work in my Gen 1 bodied KWA's were STAR pmags and even then they didn't feel very well, and the gun had a VFC mag catch installed (it helped a little with the pmags). Upgrading was a pain, I ripped several buckings getting the parts back in the oddly tight hopup chamber (which is a flawed 2 piece design for some reason, that is NOT compatible with TM/JG), and their tinkering with TM specs really got to me. After the gears in both of mine stripped, my only extra set didn't fit the bushings and so some AIM 8mm ones had to be put in. Thankfully the ones with the one 9mm bearing didn't strip though. The cylinder head really just fell apart for some reason and had to be replaced and my others didnt get very good compression with the KWA nozzle (which is off of TM spec). The GB shell is more reinforced though, but I personally find it as kind of overkill as I've never cracked a standard GB shell anywhere but the trigger post, even at 450FPS/25-27RPS. My teammate had a KWA SR10 that he bought new from ASGI, and he had problems from day 1. It never even fed decently with his MAG midcaps or my G&P/S arms ones... He eventually traded it away after it fried his lipo for a CA M16 and was very happy with that trade.

tl;dr I like G&P from a lot of past experiences with them.
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Postby Miracle » Tue Mar 08, 2011 3:13 am

The KWA 2GX gearbox is a work of art. End of story. And I don't need to see my trades when I paint my metal bodies. I'm confident every time I throw my 11.1 in there. I've seen three G&P's now over the course of my KWA 2GX's life, and each had to have considerable work done over and over again to the piston and the cylinder in order to run an 11.1

Point: everyone has their own experiences with replicas, some work, others don't, it comes down to the individual gun, and on a lesser note, the manufacturer's consistency. Debating which is the best is kind of pointless because no matter what you say, I'm only going to run guns that I've had good experiences with and that are reliable and consistent. I like KWA gas guns and 2GX aegs. Everyone else has their favorites. This is a dumb thread.
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Postby Snowman » Tue Mar 08, 2011 3:21 am

I like VFC/SOCOM Gear externals. On par with the G&Ps I've held, imo.

Now, the internals, on the other hand... VFC internals are sh*t. Mine hasn't worked properly since I've bought it, and now I deeply regret not getting a G&P, tbh.
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Postby Darius137 » Tue Mar 08, 2011 3:39 am

I really like Tokyo Marui.
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Postby Keeper » Tue Mar 08, 2011 4:32 am

TM - VSR-10 and MP5 were solid weapons and gave me a great deal of fun during some major hard use. Lower FPS, but accurate to the mark.

ECHO1 - MP5 Master Series I have is a beast. Solid construction and the swap out gearboxes was a godsend for CQB and Fields matches. Finally bit the farm after 2 1/2 years of hard use. Easily Rebuilt and works like a dream now.

AGM - Solid built MP-40 and STEN won me over. Used in several WWII events and scrims. Solid internals and never let me down. Their shotguns seem to be solid as well.

UTG - I can see some eyes rolling on this one. M4 Commando I picked up for a song and tweaked over the years. Been through hell with Snow, Mud and Rain and still kicking. Heavy and Solid construction is what kept me coming back to it.
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Postby Minerva » Tue Mar 08, 2011 9:02 am

Side note: G&P 8mm gearboxes for $80? If they are that well regarded whats up with the price?
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