FPS Rules

[lilwil]

I believe there was some sort of raised limit for DMR's a while back. The problem was, with the raised FPS limit they had the same range as a bolt rifle but the rate of fire of an AEG (albeit semi). People running around with high powered PSG1's could root out an entire team alone without having to worry about being in range of being shot.

The idea of the raised limit for the bolt rifle is because there is a significant delay between the next shot, which is much more realistic. If you keep the accuracy and the range and virtually remove the delay between shots, while incredibly awesome, you end up with noob cannons.

Now, it may be only 50 FPS or so, but still, I think AP has great rules set up already for it.

Don't dog on me, but what if somebody already has a gun (an AEG) that shoots faster than 400, but is only semi? do they downgrade and waste $150? Why not just go through the few steps to make an AEG exception for DMR's? There are those who are stupid enough to sacrifice full-auto for 50fps.

By the way... "...much more realistic..."? Today in the military most soldiers use the semi-automatic function on their weapon to increase accuracy and decrease ammunition consumption. So, Why not make this true in airsoft as well?

One more thing...
When a marksman takes out an entire squad, its because that squad is not paying attention, not doing proper clearing maneuvers, and not watching their flanks... it is extremely difficult for a marksman to get the clear shots to be able to do that without being shot first.

If you have a person significantly outranging you, and firing rounds almost as fast as an automatic, there is nothing you can do about it, it results in more people finding cover and less field movement. Just because someone did not check ahead of time before buying their rifle does not mean they should get an exception. Although you do not have to worry about that, because as a minor you can not purchase airsoft guns.

[Falcon7]

AP is not going to change their rules to include DMRs, unless in the not-so-near future DMR rules become a standard for most feilds, and maybe not even then. When I upgraded my gun, I was well aware that I would not be able to use it at many feilds. What's the point of being a marksman if you have the same range as everyone else? The abilities of a marksman are balanced by assault rifles, IMO. Of course that's why you have the rest of you squad backing you up so you can get a couple clean shots off.

If you have a person significantly outranging you, and firing rounds almost as fast as an automatic, there is nothing you can do about it, it results in more people finding cover and less field movement. [...] Although you do not have to worry about that, because as a minor you can not purchase airsoft guns.

You can shoot back and make them keep their head down, and that's what the the semi-auto-onlyness is for. People should be moving from cover to cover anyway. And as for buying replicas, the internet doesn't exactly ID you. Paypal is my friend.

[Catch22]

Some event promoters allow the use of DMR's. (semi-auto 450 or 475 fps limits) Check with the event promoters before hand to see if DMR rules are posted. Some games you won't be able to use DMR's... That's life.

[Falcon7]

550 FPS?

If you want to go that high just get a bolt action. 550 aeg is expensive and risky and things will go wrong and break.

[lilwil]

AP is not going to change their rules to include DMRs, unless in the not-so-near future DMR rules become a standard for most feilds, and maybe not even then. When I upgraded my gun, I was well aware that I would not be able to use it at many feilds. What's the point of being a marksman if you have the same range as everyone else? The abilities of a marksman are balanced by assault rifles, IMO. Of course that's why you have the rest of you squad backing you up so you can get a couple clean shots off.

If you have a person significantly outranging you, and firing rounds almost as fast as an automatic, there is nothing you can do about it, it results in more people finding cover and less field movement. [...] Although you do not have to worry about that, because as a minor you can not purchase airsoft guns.

You can shoot back and make them keep their head down, and that's what the the semi-auto-onlyness is for. People should be moving from cover to cover anyway. And as for buying replicas, the internet doesn't exactly ID you. Paypal is my friend.

People will just start making semi autos with piano triggers. And when someone is upwind and uphill from you, firing that fast with that much more range, there is nothing you can really do about it, besides halo shield.

[B.O.P. Hawk]

so don't get caught in a situation with a marksman who has the advantage over you, and/or get a marksman on your team...

I'm not gonna push too hard on this, but with how many AEG's are getting over 400, why not just make an exception that says "If your AEG has an FPS higher than 400, then it must be semi-automatic and have a non-electric trigger to be able to be used in combat."

[Falcon7]

Never heard it called a piano trigger before... Anyway, when I go semi I usually only take about two shots a second at the most. Mostly just for the fun of getting the kill in the first couple shots, instead of just spraying (large part of the reason I became a marksman in the first place.) Never really tried to see how fast I could pull the trigger. Never really get much wind where I live, thankfully.
No matter what you do, you are always going to have problems with people that are immature and do stupid stuff with their gun. Maybe there should be an 18+ limit for DMRs and bolts?

[quigly]

Most host do have a semi only rule for aegs over 400 fps.

[Mini-Marine]

Most host do have a semi only rule for aegs over 400 fps.

I wouldn't say most, but there have been more games that are implementing that rule.

Usually games of that nature limit the number of DMRs per side just like they limit the number of bolt platforms and SAWs.

snipers and marksmen do have an advantage, and can make a difference on the field if the commander deploys them properly.

On their own they aren't going to win a game for either side.

This discussion has come up plenty of times before and it will again.

While I personally am in favor of tiered FPS limits for different types of weapons, it isn't going to be happening except for at a few games here and there.

[B.O.P. Hawk]

Ditto on the command statement.
While a marksman has a lot of power when he is a lone, and even more when he is in a squad, a team of two or more assault units can easily take him out without one of them being shot. It all depends on the tactics.

Also, while a marksman is good against assault units, a qhillie sniper can easily take out a marksman before he causes any trouble, given that he has a range of at lease 125 ft, and his team is supporting him properly.

My conclusion is that Marksmen should be made into a separate class, like Assault units or snipers, and that DMRs should get their own fps limit.
...But my opinion does not weigh much in this conversation.

[lilwil]

Whats with all the birds? And I do not agree with any tiered fps tbph. I think everything should have the same fps, and let people with balls trying to take out others with bolts. But luckily I do not pay me to think.

[G36 FTW]

I still don't think anyone needs to be shooting higher than 400 fps (with bolt actions as exception).

If you have a properly installed high quality hop-up rubber and barrel you don't need 400fps for "extra range." Ever since I cut my G36's FPS from 395 to 330 I have noticed no change in range or accuracy, only fps and rof.

And how in the world do people make guns that are only physically able to shoot semi-auto? My g36 has some nice contacts but it still jams up every-once-in-a-while and I have to shoot a burst of full-auto to fix it, so if your gun is shooting semi-auto only what happens then?

[Nox]

I've seen the DMR argument made several times, and in several different ways.
#1 - Guns are more commonly being sent from the factory already chronoing over 400fps. Its the business decision that many manufacturers have made (I assume) because after the spring wears in, its still hovering at about 400. Field safety rules shouldnt be dictated by the market - so if the end user buys a gun that is over 400fps, then he better expect to either sit at home and shoot the hell out of his shrubs to wear the spring in, or buy a different spring for his gun. Cut and dried.
#2 - The DMR discussion on whether or not to include a different class or specification rule is unncessesary. I true DMR is just an accurized version of the ordinary infantry weapon. Accurized M4's, AK's, G36's....Its all infantry weapons that have bull barrels, match ammunition, and other accurizing features on it. In the airsoft DMR regard, the reason they gain range is the work put into your weapon, not hotter springs.

Any noob on the field can carry a DMR on semi only, but when amped up he can kick out as many bb's as he can rail on the trigger which often times can nearly equate to full auto. The responsibility falls in the gun user to have the trigger discipline not to hurt someone and too often I have witnessed adrenaline overcoming common sense.
I have been on the receiving end of a few 'close calls' when it comes to safety engagement rules, and also been tapped at 5 feet with a 400fps gun on full auto because the operator was too amped to call a safety kill.
Now, one bb at 400 fps hurts...at 450 or 475 one bb would get me a little more than pissed off.

If you want to have a DMR then buy an M14, M16, G36k, or other long barreled gun and accurize the hell out of it with a new bucking, tightbore barrel, and other upgrades to make it a tack driver and you'd be surprised how much range you gain.
Adding a hotter spring to any old AEG and calling it a DMR is like tacking a box mag onto an MP5 and calling it a support weapon.

[Tallahassee]

Adding a hotter spring to any old AEG and calling it a DMR is like tacking a box mag onto an MP5 and calling it a support weapon.

You're right! That MP5 needs a bigger battery too! jk

[lilwil]

If you want realism buy real steal and go visit the starbucks.